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Cannot figure out why the S2000 braking system is rubbish...(??

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  • Cannot figure out why the S2000 braking system is rubbish...(??

    Well, after going through two sets of front Cobalt friction pads and one set of front carbotechs, all in about a month's time, I can not figure out why this car eats front brakes so quickly. I thought it was just the nature of running race pads, but it is not. A good friend of mine runs a miata with an F22C that makes about 230whp and that car is unbelievably good on brakes. Last night, he mentioned that he ran four track days, one on Pocono, at least one at Sebring, and I can't remember the others. Those tracks are much harder on brakes than the tracks that I run and he measured pads after those track days to find that he still had 65% pad life. So, we calculated kinetic energy at the end of a quarter mile and it was close, which makes sense considering engine power is pretty close. So, each car is putting the same amount of energy through the braking system. The miata is much lighter at about 2100lbs, but that doesn't change the amount of energy put through the system. One thing I did think could be different is the amount of braking torque used on the S2000 is much higher since it is heavier...

    It only kills front brake pads. I have had the same set of rear pads since my first set of Cobalt Friction pads, and I have been through two sets of fronts. The rears get noticeably hotter, as they glow first. So, the car is rear biased front the factory. It seems like the car would eat rear brakes if that were the case, but it doesn't. The car also cracks front rotors just like a C5 corvette. I can crack a set in a track day with XR2's. My next plan is to put brake ducting on, but I can't see that making a huge difference in pad life. I'm starting to think that a stoptech front brake kit is the only solution, but I'd like to save $2000 if possible.

    I thought I would post this here since I know there are a couple engineers on here that may have some insight...
    Cory B.

    "Driving a race car as fast as possible is all about maintaining the highest possible acceleration level in the appropriate direction."
    http://www.youtube.com/user/nissanfanatic240

  • #2
    Sounds like it is a heat or pad size issue to me.
    You could go stock size but bigger pads and calipers with this:
    http://www.fastbrakes.com/product_p/...stock%20dp.htm

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    • #3
      Have you checked Honda-tech.com ?
      1990 240sx - Aristo 2JZGTE, R154, GT37, Defsport Wilwood kit, KTS coilovers - daily driver
      1991 civic si - B18C5 / toda / ATS / hytech - autox
      2001 integra type R - Greddy td05-18g - garage queen

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      • #4
        I'd say sticking pistons if you're going through them- is the pad wear even side to side and inner/outer pads of the same caliper?

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        • #5
          Pad wear is perfectly even and all parts slide smoothly.
          Cory B.

          "Driving a race car as fast as possible is all about maintaining the highest possible acceleration level in the appropriate direction."
          http://www.youtube.com/user/nissanfanatic240

          Comment


          • #6
            i don't own a s2k so can't speak personally, but judging from the s2000 thread i've been reading on miataturbo forums, s2k owners develop a vettesque tolerance for cracked rotors.

            may want to change them before they get this bad though

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            • #7
              They don't ever crack on track. It is afterwards during cool down. I have been able to mitigate the issue using a long cool down session with light braking in between to slowly cool the rotor, but I still never get more than a couple hard track days out of a set.

              Everything about the front brakes on the S2000 sucks. Pad life and rotor life.

              You can feel the cracks long before they get that bad. After having it happen a couple times, you can spot a hairline crack by pedal feel.

              Overall, the only conclusion I can come to is that the front brakes are simply undersized.
              Cory B.

              "Driving a race car as fast as possible is all about maintaining the highest possible acceleration level in the appropriate direction."
              http://www.youtube.com/user/nissanfanatic240

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              • #8
                shouldnt ducting fix all that?
                Originally posted by Jason M
                I have no chance to win without the Giken...

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                • #9
                  Ducting the rotors and caliper will help with the heat/cracking rotor issue. But the S2000 is close to 3000lbs, correct?

                  If so, there is your problem. Heavy cars go through pads and rotors. If you keep them stock, plan on new rotors and pads every other track event, and build it into your operating costs.

                  The ZX is the same, and other than trying to move the brake bias a little more to the back (a future modification on the books), I have to do the same. Although, so far I am not seeing the rotors crack in a catastrophic manner.

                  In my case, the rules in IT don't allow brake swaps so I have to use stock.
                  Tristan Smith
                  T-Rex Racing
                  SCCA ITR 300zx #56
                  Former SCCA ITA 240sx #56
                  IMSA RS 1978 Datsun 200sx #58

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                  • #10
                    Try ducting, cryo-treated rotors, or both.

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                    • #11
                      Any updates to this Cory?

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                      • #12
                        You need some better ducting. I ran carbotech xp10 fronts, xp8 rears with NAPA blank rotors on my s2000. Never had any issues. Used for track only and I would get about 4 track days. I was running roughly 6-7 20-30 min sessions too. I built my own ducting, my buddy is.running a.similar setup, I'll look for some pics.

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