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s14 subframe bushing replacement confusion

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  • s14 subframe bushing replacement confusion

    .
    Whats up everyone! So I decided to do the dreaded subrame bushing replacement on a s14 and had planned on using Energy Suspension's "red" polyurethane replacements. The instructions say "do not bend the 6 metal tabs they need to support the new bushing...okay, got it. Then they say remove the inner 2 rings....and the confusion sets in.

    The front and the rear pairs are sleeved different; fronts appear to have this 6-tab ring insert, a plastic sleeve insert, then maybe a shorter ring followed by a taller ring- I say "maybe" because it appears that there is only one tall ring (I'm assuming they just fit really tight together or they fused with the heat from burning out the rubber?)

    This is what I'm thinking is in each socket pair (fronts and rears):


    Pics of the instructions:





    What we're working with (I know pics are pretty bad):

    Fronts (1st two views are from the bottom of subframe, 2nd view from top of subframe):







    Rears (1st view from bottom, 2nd from top):





    It seems like that 6-tab ring has a lip underneath it that extends upward into the sleeve, making the diameter of the sleeve slightly smaller towards the bottom. If anyone has any experience with these, I would GREATLY appreciate any advice or tips you have to offer.

    I got mostly all of the old rubber out and the plastic ring, now I'm just stuck on what needs to be cut and what needs to be kept; the different sleeving for the front and the rear kind of threw me off a little too since the new bushings all appeared to have the same outer diameter.

    I suppose the backup plan is to just cut everything out of the sleeve and install solid mounts, but I really want to try to get these to work.

    .
    "A pessimist thinks the glass is half-empty, an optimist thinks the glass is half-full, an engineer says that glass is twice as big as it needs to be"
    instagram:@cleantune ; Twitter: Cleantune@Cleantune2

  • #2
    .
    I probably should've gave this a little more effort and held off on posting until I checked out how the bushing sized up to the sockets. Depth wise- it appears that the fronts will clear the inner lip below the 6-tab ring. The bottom side of larger bushing half will end up resting on the inner sleeve lip of the 6-tab, but the upper 2 rings will still need to be removed (like instructions said); and it does appear that the seam between these two bottom rings is just really tight- making them appear like one ring. With this configuration the new upper and lower bushings should still "nest in one another slightly too.

    The rear sleeve seems like it will facilitate the new bushings just the way they are. Could someone please just confirm all of this?

    Also, I noticed the inner sleeve of the fronts, specifically where the plastic sleeve was, is pretty rusted. Would it be worth putting in a little epoxy in there before the bushing goes in or should I just paint it and throw the bushing in as it is?
    .
    Last edited by cleantune; 07-08-2015, 11:45 AM.
    "A pessimist thinks the glass is half-empty, an optimist thinks the glass is half-full, an engineer says that glass is twice as big as it needs to be"
    instagram:@cleantune ; Twitter: Cleantune@Cleantune2

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    • #3
      .
      Finally got all four s14 Energy Suspension subframe bushings installed properly! I just wanted to provide some closure to this thread.

      This is what is really in the front s14 subframe sockets (excludes the OEM rubber and the center metal sleeve):


      *The rears for the s14 subframe sockets are a much simpler design with just the inner sleeve and of course the OEM rubber and the center metal sleeve.

      The instructions had said DO NOT Remove the bottom 6 tabs of the front subframe socket; I had thought these 6 tabs were connected to the second ring- the top ring hides the seam revealing the presence of the inner metal sleeve- and unfortunately I had overlooked the seam between the inner and outer subframe socket sleeves after removing the first ring.

      To summarize the front s14 subframe sockets:

      1. The top thicker ring has a groove in it, but it is just the first ring

      2. The bottom 6 tabs are part of the inner sleeve, NOT the 2nd ring- that second ring needs to come out in order to have the Energy Suspension s14 subframe bushing seat properly.

      3. The Rear s14 subframe sockets just have the inner sleeve that stays in.

      Cut into the newly sealed and painted sockets? had to :/











      The bare metal was coated with 2 coats of por15 and left to dry between each coat.

      * Greased the bushings. Then used a squeeze clamp and 2 pieces of wood to press in the tops, then the same for the bottom bushing, and finally the same technique for the new center sleeves.

      Rear:


      Front and rear:


      I know this was a fairly "simple" and "straightforward" install, but again, I have found a way to make this complicated. Hopefully there is NO question about how to install these now... if there ever was.

      .
      "A pessimist thinks the glass is half-empty, an optimist thinks the glass is half-full, an engineer says that glass is twice as big as it needs to be"
      instagram:@cleantune ; Twitter: Cleantune@Cleantune2

      Comment


      • #4
        You might want to trim off the top of the bushings to raise the subframe up.
        '18 Chevrolet Volt - Electric fun hatch for DD duty!


        DefSport Koni Sleeve and Spring Perch Buy!!!
        http://www.nissanroadracing.com/showthread.php?t=5902

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        • #5
          Yeah, I've only every done S13 subframes in the past, so when I did my S14 subframe a month or so back I was pretty surprised!

          www.2LiterTurbo.com (Personal Site)
          96 240SX SE: Track Car | 90 Skyline GTR: Bucket List Car | 07 Legacy Spec B: The DD

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          • #6
            Originally posted by 2_Liter_Turbo View Post
            Yeah, I've only every done S13 subframes in the past, so when I did my S14 subframe a month or so back I was pretty surprised!
            yeah, I know right?! Just make them all the same Nissan!

            Originally posted by Def View Post
            You might want to trim off the top of the bushings to raise the subframe up.
            I had read about this in the past and from what I remember, the top of the OEM bushings did sit a little lower and doing this would help the lowered suspension geo a bit- in regard to "fuller travel" and to limit potential binding. What would be the best way to do this?

            There was an S15 at the track that had these bushings installed and they appeared to have "squished down" when they were installed; since they appeared shorter and the sides were rounded out over the sockets they were in. I'm almost positive I had compared the OEM and Energy Suspension center metal sleeves and found them to be the same height- I suppose this metal part could be trimmed too though.

            Also, I could always look this up, but does anyone know offhand if there are any track class rules against this type of subframe mounting mod?

            .
            "A pessimist thinks the glass is half-empty, an optimist thinks the glass is half-full, an engineer says that glass is twice as big as it needs to be"
            instagram:@cleantune ; Twitter: Cleantune@Cleantune2

            Comment


            • #7
              It's technically relocating the subframe - are you just driving DEs, or doing TT/W2W?


              As for the benefits, it helps correct the roll center somewhat in the rear, and brings the suspension kinematics somewhat back in line. Basically 10 mm raising the subframe up = the same kinematics as running 10 mm higher rideheight.
              '18 Chevrolet Volt - Electric fun hatch for DD duty!


              DefSport Koni Sleeve and Spring Perch Buy!!!
              http://www.nissanroadracing.com/showthread.php?t=5902

              Comment


              • #8
                .
                Ugh, yeah that's kind of what I was afraid of. The reason I mentioned this is because last year I was talking to someone in the Nos Formula D support crew, and I know that's not a time attack kind of motorsport, but even they were saying that they had to put a washer or two on top of their solid subframe mounts to meet regulation- so just figured this is probably /most likely the case with Time Attack.

                Wheel 2 Wheel kind of scares me at the moment, haha; so most likely just some HPDE or Time Attack.

                That all makes sense- raise the subframe lower roll center. I'm thinking maybe before a decision is made on trimming the bushings, I'll just put the subframe up there, torque everything, and then check everything thing out- this way it will be easier to tell how much of the bushing would need to come off. The top bushing does look really high.

                *Compared to installing new bushings on the rear arms without a press, dropping the rear subframe is cake haha.
                .
                Last edited by cleantune; 08-17-2015, 02:35 AM.
                "A pessimist thinks the glass is half-empty, an optimist thinks the glass is half-full, an engineer says that glass is twice as big as it needs to be"
                instagram:@cleantune ; Twitter: Cleantune@Cleantune2

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